WLP306 Developing a Team Habit of Sitting Less
Today’s guest Stefan Zavalin goes into detail about how he works with teams in organisations to sit less. There is plenty here for you to incorporate into your team. Plus, the conversation is also relevant to those involved in introducing change.
A quick hello from Pilar, reflecting on the importance of discussing with team members any changes of location, as it might impact the kind of work you can do comfortably.
Dr Stefan Zevalin is the Author of “Sit Less: Evolve Your Work and Life Without Compromising Your Health” and the founder of Love to Move, which he set up to address the sedentary aspects of work culture and how we should evolve our desk jobs.
Both Pilar and Stefan were standing up for the recording, which often helps the voice, by giving the full body energy to it.
Stefan is a doctor of physical therapy. He used to focus on treating individual patients but he soon noticed they were returning after a while, because they hadn’t changed anything in their lifestyle. He was just “fixing the symptoms, not fixing the issue”. So he decided to start working to prevent these kind of physical problems.
With individuals, his work is about developing habits that can be incorporated into your workflow. For example, by walking during meetings.
When he works with organisations, the approach is different. He starts by looking for the social buy-in of a team, so that all team members can start the change together. For example, by making it ok to stand during meetings, so that people don’t feel exposed, or feel like they are the odd one out. Getting movement throughout the day seamlessly improves productivity, mental health etc. and this is what Stefan is helping organisations do.
The biggest block in organisations when introducing these new habits is the current norm - if anything different to sitting down at your desk is frowned upon, then transitioning to a more “mobile” lifestyle is going to be difficult, especially if people are in the office together. Change doesn’t have to be huge - we have to start small, for example by reducing the time we’re sitting down by 1 hour out of 8.
Dr. Stefan Zavalin
Stefan prefers to work with teams of max. 25 so that there’s a greater chance of them taking action. This size of team probably has a visible culture and team members know each other and what they all like/dislike. This means he can assess what people like in terms of movement, so that the new intervention matches the team e.g. there's no point in getting a ping-pong table if nobody likes ping pong!
At the same time, you can assess whether there’s movement that can be done together. For example by standing together during an online meeting, or taking breaks independently and then checking in with each other. It helps to have a range of accessible things within the team they can do together e.g. walking might be suitable for some, but not others.
This is a good conversation to have in the team anyway, as it can bring up the diversity in the team, and the similarities. It can help team members connect with each other.
There’s a misconception that in order to be mobile at work - whether in the office or home - that you need a standing desk. But that’s not the case, as Stefan explains in his blog post, Why You Shouldn’t Get a Standing Desk. (And he’s written this other one since him and Pilar spoke: So You Decided to Get a Standing Desk.)
Once a team has decided what they want to try out, it’s a matter of trial and error. At the beginning of committing to the change, there’s a lot of motivation to get behind the new habits. But within two weeks, the motivation decreases and we go back to old habits - especially if we’ve been conditioned to sit throughout our day since we were children.
Some individuals might want to go onto the next stage before everyone else, but it’s important that the whole team tries out the same change together, to see how the team adapts (or not) to the change.
Stefan advocates for “sitting less” rather than “moving more” because it gets us thinking about removing something we’re doing, rather than adding more to our plate.
It often feels like we have to do MORE when we are going through a change process.
27.20 Mins
The benefits of sitting less: standing computer work is 46% more effective than sitting, over one hour. (Bear in mind you can stand for 3 - 4 hour eventually during the day). A 10 minute walk or a 2 minute active chore can “reset” us when we start to feel like our energy is decreasing, and our thinking is less clear.
To be able to incorporate this into a team or organisation needs the right culture - what we look like when we’re working might start to look different. Reduction in sedentary behaviour in workplaces has not really shown whether a top down approach or down top works best - goof communication throughout is probably the best approach, and for management to support those employees who want to make a change.
Stefan talks about the difference between facilitation and encouragement: encouraging movement is not as strong as facilitating it. An example of facilitating this is: “sitting is good for you, so we’re providing you with 3 five minute breaks for movement in the morning and afternoon.” It’s not about giving permission, but also providing a specific structure so that people have enough guidance to act on it.
It’s also good to show what does “movement-based” look like. The language we use is also important eg, “everyone stop standing around and go to work” or “let’s start work, take a seat” gives the impression that work is only done when we’re sitting down.
This conversation is also of interest to those designing the office for a hybrid workforce, who want people to come into the office. Will it be easy to sit less there?
It’s the culture that spans throughout the workforce, not the office. Paying attention to how we treat people becomes even more attractive, as that is what might retain people.
38.12 MINS
Stefan became legally blind while he was studying for his graduate, due to an eye infection, which meant that he was very well prepared for his Ted Talk Move More Sit Less, as these talks require that you memorise the script word for word. The talk is a great advocacy tool for anyone who wants to explain to others why they should adopt a “sit less” approach.
To navigate the online space, Stefan uses large screens, even plugging his phone to a large TV if he’s staying in accommodation as part of his travels. Widespread digitalisation is also very useful, as he can use a screen reader to access whatever he needs to read.
And networking can be done online, without travelling, making interactions easier. Also, he finds it difficult to see faces in crowds too, and distinguishes people by the colour of their clothes, for example.
When meeting people online, in real-time, Stefan can prepare in advance and knows exactly who he is talking to (rather than having to find them in a physical space). All of his talks and summits are done online, though he needs someone to read out the chat.
Stefan tends to stay away from text-heavy online social networks like Twitter, as it doesn’t work as well when you have the screen reader reading everything out. He prefers to create videos, and the tech helps to read comments. However, he does struggle with videos with captions, as they move quite quickly.
With clients, Stefan likes to move into video calls after the first few emails, as they help him get to know the person faster - and of course, he pays a lot of attention to a person’s physical presence as part of his work.
Finally, let’s hold on to the idea of “sit less”, as in doing less of things that are bad for us, rather than trying to add more things to our plate.
You can find out more about Stefan go to stefanzavalin.com and check out his book “Sit Less: Evolve Your Work and Life Without Compromising Your Health”.
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